If you had the good fortune to skip the presidential debate last night, the CNN headline sums it up: “Biden’s poor showing and Trump’s repeated falsehoods.” There was little surprising in Trump’s performance, except perhaps that he was somewhat more disciplined than is often the case (at least with respect to his behavior if not his accuracy). That said, any number of answers he gave would have been astonishing had they come from any candidate in any party in the pre-Trump era. His demonization of immigrants should be particularly jarring, not to mention his “I did not have sex with a porn star,” but the truth is, most of us are used to it.
I liked what Heather Cox Richardson wrote this morning about how trump was Gish galloping last night. It’s hard to debate someone who is lying constantly. Also this quote is what is making me stay strong today that we don’t have a choice now and I’m supporting Biden. “but as Monique Pressley put it, “The proof of Biden’s ability to run the country is the fact that he is running it. Successfully. Not a debate performance against a pathological lying sociopath”.
I need to keep remembering that this is real and we can’t let our discouragement of this one poor performance shatter our ability to outvote trump.
I read her post and I disagree. That's exactly what Trump was doing, yes, but Biden was so far off his mark. A stumble here or there is one thing. What happened last night seemed like something else entirely.
I honestly can't find an angle where his performance isn't judged "poor" at best. Which isn't to say he didn't have a few good points, but he missed so many opportunities to push back and clarify, for whatever reason, and the stakes are simply too high for that.
Well, here are Heather Cox Richardson's own words. You can disagree, of course. I have no option because I did not watch the debate. She usually has a keen ability to see past the surface, however.
"Immediately after the debate, there were calls for Biden to drop out of the race, but aside from the fact that the only time a presidential candidate has ever done that—in 1968—it threw the race into utter confusion and the president’s party lost, Biden needed to demonstrate that his mental capacity is strong in order to push back on the Republicans’ insistence that he is incapable of being president. That, he did, thoroughly. Biden began with a weak start but hit his stride as the evening wore on. Indeed, he covered his bases too thoroughly, listing the many accomplishments of his administration in such a hurry that he was sometimes hard to understand."
In the following paragraph, Heather describes how Trump, by contrast, became more incoherent as the debate wore on. But her most important comments descrI've Trump's gaslighting strategy, called the Gish gallop, and also media complicity by letting Trump, as always, call the shots. The full column is important reading, I think. But I have no way to link it on this device.
Actual Christians need to step up and firmly draw a line: “You cannot be a Christian and support what Donald Trump is and what Donald Trump stands for. You have to choose one path or the other.”
This is no time for generous ecumenism. Christian Nationalism isn’t a particular flavor of Christianity. It is hostile to the Gospel to its core.
I sympathize, but there is no one on earth who has true authority to say who is, and who is not, an "actual Christian." And there is no one on earth who has true authority to say what is and isn't Christianity, and what is and isn't the Gospel.
No one.
(Chrissy Stroop is very, very good (and seemingly indefatigable) at applying this truth to us who want to call Trump devotees non-Christians, fake Christians, etc., and showing how calling them that anyway is always implicitly Christian supremacist and anti-pluralistic.)
If you don't like that that's the way it is, ask Jesus why he left things that way. I think he had very good reasons. Keep asking. As he told us to.
Jesus (and no one else) gets to say who is and who is not now a good-enough follower of him, but that's not the same as being a Christian. Being a Christian is saying that you long to be always a good-enough follower of him. Or that's my understanding.
I could join you in saying to folks, if you would, "While your Christianity condones Donald Trump's wishes for the world, I'll never be able to embrace your Christianity nor your Jesus nor your God. Jesus loves those Donald Trump performs his hatred upon. I will never be able to join you in 'know[ing] [...] Trump Christ, and him crucified'."
At last night’s debate I saw one candidate who showed up clearly not feeling well, but who tried his best to tell how he has improved the lives of Americans throughout his presidency. And the other candidate showed up to get sound bites for future commercials, ignoring practically all of the questions he was asked about, and whose sharp and venomous tongue spewed lies and painted a dystopian American. My heart broke for Biden who at this point in his life, after all the good he has done for his country, should be enjoying time with his family, rather than being verbally assaulted by a convicted felon.
"We’ve been working for years to fend off threats from an authoritarian Right, only to see Biden (and, it’s fair to say, the Democratic Party) fail to step up in such a critical moment." NO, NO, NO - respectfully, I disagree. It was one poor performance on one single night, but Joe Biden has performed well as president. Who has really failed us? 1) The Republican party for nominating a convicted felon, adjudicated fraudster and rapist, who promises to bring down our democratic system in favor of an authoritarian regime for him and his pals. 2) The media, for legitimizing Trump as a viable candidate when any other candidate with even a scintilla of his wrongdoing (much less being a convicted felon) would have been relentlessly hounded in the press. 3) Members of the Biden coalition who are not supporting him b/c of one bad night, even though he is a decent man, strongly supports democratic principles, and has a great record as president. So, by giving in to defeatism, WE are failing to step up in a critical moment. I refuse to do that.
Here's the thing. I can agree that he's performed well as president. I agree that the Republican party has absolutely failed us. No question. I'm happy to blame the media, too. I think Biden is a decent an honorable man who has done well and I also think his capacity has noticably declined, even in the past few months. Acknowledging that isn't giving into defeatism. A strong Biden would be the right man for the hour. We do not have that. That said, I absolutely think each of us needs to step up. The next weeks will help give shape to what that will look like.
Why all the calls for Biden to step down but no calls for the pathological liar, adjudicated rapist, and convicted felon to get out of the race? As Dr. Heather Cox Richardson wrote this morning, the media are still letting Trump call the shots. After nine years of this, they should know better.
Because people have been calling out Trump's unfitness for office for 9 years now and we all know that the Rebublicans have no intentions of dropping him regardless of what he does. I thought the CNN headline got things right. The story is Trump's unprecedented level of lying and also Biden's inability to articulate clearly what is at stake at a time when our democracy depends on it.
Jemar's words near the end of this Convocation should be required listening for everyone of voting age in America! Such wise, reassuring, and inspiring words. All 3 of you offered profound insights. Thank you - i needed this! (from a Canuck, wondering nervously how roughly our weighty neighbour sleeping next to us will roll over! )
This is a crisis (as I heard Bill Kristol on the Bulwark say after the debate). However, I think this could absolutely be the best thing that could have happened at this moment. Here’s why: we have been forced into a crisis 5 months out and not 4 or 3 or 2. The crisis was always coming. Those who have been concerned about Biden’s age anticipated this exact thing. Now, the strength and intelligence of the pro-democracy coalition that is passionate about saving democracy should share their best ideas and let’s move forward. Sometimes a crisis is the very best thing to bring clarity and move us in the right direction.
I agree with you when you say: “it’s hard not to feel betrayed by both parties right now”. I lament the wasted opportunities that were missed by not having a democratic primary to engage voters, bring fresh energy, articulate the accomplishments of the Biden administration and illustrate what a new democratic administration would carry forward and improve upon. I think about the months of media coverage and excitement that could have been focused on the best Democratic nominees that could bring knowledge and awareness to those voters who wouldn’t be paying attention otherwise. Perhaps they can capture some of that in the weeks to come ahead of the Democratic convention. Fingers crossed 🤞
One point that I think is lost in all the debate pearl-clutching going on by the Democratic party lies in this quote by Monique Pressley-"The proof of Biden’s ability to run the country is the fact that he is running it. Successfully. Not a debate performance against a pathological lying sociopath.” I'd vote for Joe even if he ran for President from a hospital bed.
Yes, looking back over the past 4 years, 100%. Looking forward, if our two choices are Biden and Trump, it's an easy call. The question is whether it should have come down to these two choices.
I didn’t watch, I couldn’t. I figured people who needed to watch because it’s their job would inform me 😆. I don’t think it is dramatic to say that this is a dark time for our country. As many people have said, history will not be kind to us when it reflects back to these years.
I like the quote you included by Steve Schmidt, “Trump is a threat and democracy is on the line, then Biden must step aside. His duty, oath and legacy require an act of humility and selflessness,”
The truth is that Biden was behind in the polls before the debate, with Nate Silver (an independent polling expert) putting a 60% probability on a Trump win. That probability plummeted last night. The problem with his popularity has always been his age. And the view of insiders on Biden's cognitive decline was more dire than the public perception of it - before the debate. Yes, voters are mad about inflation (even though it was not fully Biden's fault), but Trump is one of the most unpopular presidential candidates in history. The only reason Trump looked coherent last night was because he was standing next to Biden.
I do agree that Democrats have an opportunity to bury the Republicans by swapping Biden with a younger coherent and likable candidate. It may not work, but what they are doing now is not working either. The pressure for Biden to step down is intense right now, since it is up to him. I suspect, however, that they will replace him with an ideologue that is not particularly popular with voters outside of the Democratic orbit, and lower their odds of success.
Always appreciate the insights from all three of you. In this instance, it is so gut wrenching to have my own impressions confirmed. The debate was a disaster. Biden clearly didn’t meet the moment. Trump doubled down on his demagogue narratives, about immigrants in particular. His comments about J6 continue the attempt to whitewash what we saw that day. This debate puts him closer to a return to power. I’m discouraged.
It will be interesting to see and hear from the “average voter” in the coming days. Were trump’s lies apparent to them? Did President Biden look like a deranged uncle or dear old grandpa?
I’m not sure replacing him is the best option. Too chaotic. There’s got to be a way to hedge the “endearing old grandpa” view in the coming months. To his credit he is just a plain old good person.
Having said that…as someone that is to the left of most of the Dem party…Palestine looms LARGE for many of us. Not sure how that will affect votes, but it’s very real disillusionment.
I’m worried about low information voters… they seem to see strength in different terms than the informed voters. Trump’s bluster and bullying can easily be mistaken as powerful and influential. The low information voter isn’t necessarily going to fact check him, and might be easily swayed to support him. We saw this happen in 2016. This is a monumental moment in our nation’s history, one where our democracy hangs in the balance. The leadership of the Democratic Party would do well to recognize this, and rather than force a candidate on the people based on the fear that nobody else but Biden is capable of taking on the role of President, they could put forth a candidate who can effectively dispel the lies and take on the bullying that Trump brings to the debate stage. I think President Biden should be allowed to finish his term with dignity, pass the baton on to another capable democratic candidate, then move on so he can enjoy life in his golden years. After all the decades of commitment has devoted to serving his country he has earned that. We, the people who support democracy, owe him that.
I re-watched the full concession speech given by Senator John McCain when he lost his presidential bid in 2008 to then Senator Barack Obama and it spoke volumes to both his character and his dedication to his country. We are in a moment where this type of leadership matters. There is no shame in President Biden serving as a one term president. (To watch Sen. McCain’s concession speech go to YouTube or there is a link in Steve Schmidt’s Substack post “It is time to pass the torch”)
I am deeply disappointed with the Democratic Party. Pres. Biden isn’t a bad person and he’s had a huge mess to clean up, but he’s also an establishment politician and frankly not progressive enough. What if we had a candidate folks could get excited about?
For these past 50 years, getting elected President as a Democrat means cleaning up a huge mess left by the Republican administration(s) you are following, while knowing you'll be blamed every day for that mess and have it used against you by your Republican challenger in 3 years. Part of the job.
"not progressive enough" -- Biden ran on the most progressive platform of any major-party Presidential nominee ever.
"What if we had a candidate folks [read: progressives] could get excited about?" -- Most likely they would lose the general election. Democracy is not for our excitement but for (at its very best) finding the common good and moving us towards that. Representation is problematic; please don't ever be so mean to yourself as to look to representation for excitement or surrender your autonomy to it.
I liked what Heather Cox Richardson wrote this morning about how trump was Gish galloping last night. It’s hard to debate someone who is lying constantly. Also this quote is what is making me stay strong today that we don’t have a choice now and I’m supporting Biden. “but as Monique Pressley put it, “The proof of Biden’s ability to run the country is the fact that he is running it. Successfully. Not a debate performance against a pathological lying sociopath”.
I need to keep remembering that this is real and we can’t let our discouragement of this one poor performance shatter our ability to outvote trump.
I read her post and I disagree. That's exactly what Trump was doing, yes, but Biden was so far off his mark. A stumble here or there is one thing. What happened last night seemed like something else entirely.
Heather also pointed out that Biden's performance last night was in fact far from "poor."
I honestly can't find an angle where his performance isn't judged "poor" at best. Which isn't to say he didn't have a few good points, but he missed so many opportunities to push back and clarify, for whatever reason, and the stakes are simply too high for that.
Well, here are Heather Cox Richardson's own words. You can disagree, of course. I have no option because I did not watch the debate. She usually has a keen ability to see past the surface, however.
"Immediately after the debate, there were calls for Biden to drop out of the race, but aside from the fact that the only time a presidential candidate has ever done that—in 1968—it threw the race into utter confusion and the president’s party lost, Biden needed to demonstrate that his mental capacity is strong in order to push back on the Republicans’ insistence that he is incapable of being president. That, he did, thoroughly. Biden began with a weak start but hit his stride as the evening wore on. Indeed, he covered his bases too thoroughly, listing the many accomplishments of his administration in such a hurry that he was sometimes hard to understand."
In the following paragraph, Heather describes how Trump, by contrast, became more incoherent as the debate wore on. But her most important comments descrI've Trump's gaslighting strategy, called the Gish gallop, and also media complicity by letting Trump, as always, call the shots. The full column is important reading, I think. But I have no way to link it on this device.
Should have been "opinion," not "option" in the 1st paragraph.
Actual Christians need to step up and firmly draw a line: “You cannot be a Christian and support what Donald Trump is and what Donald Trump stands for. You have to choose one path or the other.”
This is no time for generous ecumenism. Christian Nationalism isn’t a particular flavor of Christianity. It is hostile to the Gospel to its core.
I sympathize, but there is no one on earth who has true authority to say who is, and who is not, an "actual Christian." And there is no one on earth who has true authority to say what is and isn't Christianity, and what is and isn't the Gospel.
No one.
(Chrissy Stroop is very, very good (and seemingly indefatigable) at applying this truth to us who want to call Trump devotees non-Christians, fake Christians, etc., and showing how calling them that anyway is always implicitly Christian supremacist and anti-pluralistic.)
If you don't like that that's the way it is, ask Jesus why he left things that way. I think he had very good reasons. Keep asking. As he told us to.
Jesus (and no one else) gets to say who is and who is not now a good-enough follower of him, but that's not the same as being a Christian. Being a Christian is saying that you long to be always a good-enough follower of him. Or that's my understanding.
I could join you in saying to folks, if you would, "While your Christianity condones Donald Trump's wishes for the world, I'll never be able to embrace your Christianity nor your Jesus nor your God. Jesus loves those Donald Trump performs his hatred upon. I will never be able to join you in 'know[ing] [...] Trump Christ, and him crucified'."
At last night’s debate I saw one candidate who showed up clearly not feeling well, but who tried his best to tell how he has improved the lives of Americans throughout his presidency. And the other candidate showed up to get sound bites for future commercials, ignoring practically all of the questions he was asked about, and whose sharp and venomous tongue spewed lies and painted a dystopian American. My heart broke for Biden who at this point in his life, after all the good he has done for his country, should be enjoying time with his family, rather than being verbally assaulted by a convicted felon.
This captures well my feelings while watching. Deep respect for Biden, which is part of what made last night so difficult.
"We’ve been working for years to fend off threats from an authoritarian Right, only to see Biden (and, it’s fair to say, the Democratic Party) fail to step up in such a critical moment." NO, NO, NO - respectfully, I disagree. It was one poor performance on one single night, but Joe Biden has performed well as president. Who has really failed us? 1) The Republican party for nominating a convicted felon, adjudicated fraudster and rapist, who promises to bring down our democratic system in favor of an authoritarian regime for him and his pals. 2) The media, for legitimizing Trump as a viable candidate when any other candidate with even a scintilla of his wrongdoing (much less being a convicted felon) would have been relentlessly hounded in the press. 3) Members of the Biden coalition who are not supporting him b/c of one bad night, even though he is a decent man, strongly supports democratic principles, and has a great record as president. So, by giving in to defeatism, WE are failing to step up in a critical moment. I refuse to do that.
Here's the thing. I can agree that he's performed well as president. I agree that the Republican party has absolutely failed us. No question. I'm happy to blame the media, too. I think Biden is a decent an honorable man who has done well and I also think his capacity has noticably declined, even in the past few months. Acknowledging that isn't giving into defeatism. A strong Biden would be the right man for the hour. We do not have that. That said, I absolutely think each of us needs to step up. The next weeks will help give shape to what that will look like.
Why all the calls for Biden to step down but no calls for the pathological liar, adjudicated rapist, and convicted felon to get out of the race? As Dr. Heather Cox Richardson wrote this morning, the media are still letting Trump call the shots. After nine years of this, they should know better.
Because people have been calling out Trump's unfitness for office for 9 years now and we all know that the Rebublicans have no intentions of dropping him regardless of what he does. I thought the CNN headline got things right. The story is Trump's unprecedented level of lying and also Biden's inability to articulate clearly what is at stake at a time when our democracy depends on it.
Jemar's words near the end of this Convocation should be required listening for everyone of voting age in America! Such wise, reassuring, and inspiring words. All 3 of you offered profound insights. Thank you - i needed this! (from a Canuck, wondering nervously how roughly our weighty neighbour sleeping next to us will roll over! )
I was just telling that to someone else--Jemar always has just the right words.
He does!
This is a crisis (as I heard Bill Kristol on the Bulwark say after the debate). However, I think this could absolutely be the best thing that could have happened at this moment. Here’s why: we have been forced into a crisis 5 months out and not 4 or 3 or 2. The crisis was always coming. Those who have been concerned about Biden’s age anticipated this exact thing. Now, the strength and intelligence of the pro-democracy coalition that is passionate about saving democracy should share their best ideas and let’s move forward. Sometimes a crisis is the very best thing to bring clarity and move us in the right direction.
I agree with you when you say: “it’s hard not to feel betrayed by both parties right now”. I lament the wasted opportunities that were missed by not having a democratic primary to engage voters, bring fresh energy, articulate the accomplishments of the Biden administration and illustrate what a new democratic administration would carry forward and improve upon. I think about the months of media coverage and excitement that could have been focused on the best Democratic nominees that could bring knowledge and awareness to those voters who wouldn’t be paying attention otherwise. Perhaps they can capture some of that in the weeks to come ahead of the Democratic convention. Fingers crossed 🤞
I was thinking the same thing, although historically speaking, having a candidate drop out at this point is almost always disastrous.
One point that I think is lost in all the debate pearl-clutching going on by the Democratic party lies in this quote by Monique Pressley-"The proof of Biden’s ability to run the country is the fact that he is running it. Successfully. Not a debate performance against a pathological lying sociopath.” I'd vote for Joe even if he ran for President from a hospital bed.
Yes, looking back over the past 4 years, 100%. Looking forward, if our two choices are Biden and Trump, it's an easy call. The question is whether it should have come down to these two choices.
I’ve had this feeling of a gut punch once before, the night Trump was elected. No amount of spin will take it away.
I didn’t watch, I couldn’t. I figured people who needed to watch because it’s their job would inform me 😆. I don’t think it is dramatic to say that this is a dark time for our country. As many people have said, history will not be kind to us when it reflects back to these years.
I like the quote you included by Steve Schmidt, “Trump is a threat and democracy is on the line, then Biden must step aside. His duty, oath and legacy require an act of humility and selflessness,”
Reason #1 I am, and have always been a progressive and socialist. Corporate conservatives and "business as usual" will not suffice.
The truth is that Biden was behind in the polls before the debate, with Nate Silver (an independent polling expert) putting a 60% probability on a Trump win. That probability plummeted last night. The problem with his popularity has always been his age. And the view of insiders on Biden's cognitive decline was more dire than the public perception of it - before the debate. Yes, voters are mad about inflation (even though it was not fully Biden's fault), but Trump is one of the most unpopular presidential candidates in history. The only reason Trump looked coherent last night was because he was standing next to Biden.
I do agree that Democrats have an opportunity to bury the Republicans by swapping Biden with a younger coherent and likable candidate. It may not work, but what they are doing now is not working either. The pressure for Biden to step down is intense right now, since it is up to him. I suspect, however, that they will replace him with an ideologue that is not particularly popular with voters outside of the Democratic orbit, and lower their odds of success.
Always appreciate the insights from all three of you. In this instance, it is so gut wrenching to have my own impressions confirmed. The debate was a disaster. Biden clearly didn’t meet the moment. Trump doubled down on his demagogue narratives, about immigrants in particular. His comments about J6 continue the attempt to whitewash what we saw that day. This debate puts him closer to a return to power. I’m discouraged.
It will be interesting to see and hear from the “average voter” in the coming days. Were trump’s lies apparent to them? Did President Biden look like a deranged uncle or dear old grandpa?
I’m not sure replacing him is the best option. Too chaotic. There’s got to be a way to hedge the “endearing old grandpa” view in the coming months. To his credit he is just a plain old good person.
Having said that…as someone that is to the left of most of the Dem party…Palestine looms LARGE for many of us. Not sure how that will affect votes, but it’s very real disillusionment.
I’m worried about low information voters… they seem to see strength in different terms than the informed voters. Trump’s bluster and bullying can easily be mistaken as powerful and influential. The low information voter isn’t necessarily going to fact check him, and might be easily swayed to support him. We saw this happen in 2016. This is a monumental moment in our nation’s history, one where our democracy hangs in the balance. The leadership of the Democratic Party would do well to recognize this, and rather than force a candidate on the people based on the fear that nobody else but Biden is capable of taking on the role of President, they could put forth a candidate who can effectively dispel the lies and take on the bullying that Trump brings to the debate stage. I think President Biden should be allowed to finish his term with dignity, pass the baton on to another capable democratic candidate, then move on so he can enjoy life in his golden years. After all the decades of commitment has devoted to serving his country he has earned that. We, the people who support democracy, owe him that.
I re-watched the full concession speech given by Senator John McCain when he lost his presidential bid in 2008 to then Senator Barack Obama and it spoke volumes to both his character and his dedication to his country. We are in a moment where this type of leadership matters. There is no shame in President Biden serving as a one term president. (To watch Sen. McCain’s concession speech go to YouTube or there is a link in Steve Schmidt’s Substack post “It is time to pass the torch”)
I am deeply disappointed with the Democratic Party. Pres. Biden isn’t a bad person and he’s had a huge mess to clean up, but he’s also an establishment politician and frankly not progressive enough. What if we had a candidate folks could get excited about?
I think he deserves more credit for stabilizing the country, especially in the first couple of years.
For these past 50 years, getting elected President as a Democrat means cleaning up a huge mess left by the Republican administration(s) you are following, while knowing you'll be blamed every day for that mess and have it used against you by your Republican challenger in 3 years. Part of the job.
"not progressive enough" -- Biden ran on the most progressive platform of any major-party Presidential nominee ever.
"What if we had a candidate folks [read: progressives] could get excited about?" -- Most likely they would lose the general election. Democracy is not for our excitement but for (at its very best) finding the common good and moving us towards that. Representation is problematic; please don't ever be so mean to yourself as to look to representation for excitement or surrender your autonomy to it.
Thank you 🙏🏼